How is this even a question? One guy has 2 pro bowls, 2 sb appearances, sb ring, and a Super Bowl MVP. The other guy has nothing but a one pro bowl. This is disrespectful.
History has taught us time and time again that the eyeball test doesn't tell you everything. There's been a lot of fantastic athletes that have failed to quarterback in the NFL.
Does everyone just pretend that rushing stats don’t count? Jalen played 18 games total this season. (Counting playoffs) He completed 70% of his passes. Threw for 3,629 yards. 8 ypa. 23 TDs and 6 ints. That ALONE makes him competitive with Herbert. Hurts RUSHED for 824 yards!!!!!!!!!!!! There is no way 31 GM’s would choose Herbert over Hurts knowing what they know now. Just admit you’re wrong dude. You’ll still be good at your job.
@@dawillia88horrible comp. One has 137 passing touchdowns and 45 picks , which is a 3-1 td to int ratio while the other has 69 and 46 and a 1-1 td to int ratio, Herbert is on a whole nother level compared Lawrence.
@@Smegma59 Hey! I think you may have misunderstood my point. I brought in Hurts’ stats to demonstrate that his passing numbers are actually not as bad as people thinks wish pushes him closer to Herbert, passing wise than Hurts gets credit for. Those are the numbers. My point is, that when you account for Jalen’s rushing then it’s hard to choose Herbert. The guy above pointed out some of Herbert’s measurables as the reason GM’s would choose Herbert. Height being one of them. My point was Trevor Lawrence is tall too; it doesn’t really mean that much in the end. So I wasn’t really comparing Herbert to Lawrence. Overall, sure every GM would take Herbert over Hurts…5 years ago. But knowing what we know now; why would a team like the Eagles not want a super accurate dual threat running back? I don’t even have an issue with some GM’s taking Herbert. Dude is great. This guy said 32 GM’s would. It’s just disrespectful.
Love the show!! The Caleb Williams take is nuts. His first half stats are just as good if not better. He also had to work with a terrible 15 play script to start games
Jalen Hurts is 11 - 3 lifetime against Patrick Mahomes, Josh allen, Joe Burrow, Jayden Daniels, Matt Stafford, & Lamar Jackson. Not ONE of those QB’s has a winning record against him. There is Zero argument of Justin Herbert over Jalen Hurts… Hilariously though, Herbert is 1 - 0 against Hurts catching him many years ago when this was still a valid argument.
@@Jiveturkey6969Herbert likely was better then! That ship sailed a long time ago however. Herbert was born good. Hurts had to rocky balboa his way to championship MVP with heart grit and determination.
Herbert v Hurts is the PERFECT podcast/debate show topic! Hurts has the wins that matter most and played pretty damn well in his two biggest games. One a SB win!! Herbert has ALL the measurables; height, mobility, arm strength, etc. but is a .500 QB with no playoff wins. Everybody would take Hurts career to this point. But if you’re building a team and can choose your QB it’d be hard not to pick Herbert. The age old ‘if you put him on the Eagles’ with that team is pretty true for once…
It’s not true. The eagles would’ve been bounced in the first round. Herbert shrinks in big games. He doesn’t have a killer gene in his body. Changing teams or talent around him won’t ever change that. He’d somehow shit the bed in playoffs n eagles would get bounced.
That’s not true either, he’s never had the offensive AND defensive support around him that Hurts has. Jalen makes the most of it and plays his best in big moments USUALLY. You’re conveniently forgetting when they shit the bed against the Bucs in the 1st round of the playoffs… Hurts knows who he is and doesn’t try to prove he’s something he’s not. Its much easier to be the trust fund kid who just needs to not crash the BMW…
@@ChiefsFan15-q8y lol Jalen didn’t shit the bed against the Bucs in 23………he was 25/35 for 256 yards n 1 TD. That’s not shitting the bed buddy. The team had already quit weeks before. Shitting the bed is what Herbert does throwing 4 picks or blowing a 27 pt lead. Or what Mahomes just did in the SB. That’s shitting the bed💯….shitting the bed means you have to play like shit🤷🏻♂️
I’d rather have Jalen Hurts simply because he is a winner and Herbert is not. Herbert is the better pocket passer on most days, but he doesn’t have the ice in his veins for clutch time like Jalen. That’s why Jalen has a Super Bowl trophy with two appearances and Herbert has never passed the first round of the playoffs
If the Eagles had a choice between Hurts or Justin, they likely would flip in a heartbeat. Do not under-estimate the talent that the Eagles have on that roster.
Last season was the first time Herbert had a good hc, but unfortunately still not a good oc. And he had to work with little run game and a way below average receiving corps, whereas Hurts had Saquon Barkley, a top o line and very good receivers. The Eagles have one of the two or three best rosters in the entire NFL, whereas the Chargers are far from stacked on offense. When Herbert had good receivers - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams - they couldn't stay healthy. Jalen Hurts is a good qb on a great team, it's not like he dragged a bunch of scrubs to the Super Bowl, like Elway did in the 1980s.
" Becasue hes a winner " did you forget he has th best defense in the league best offensive line, best RB in the league, A top 5 WR in the league. And he played for Alabama in college....
It’s crazy what having a stacked team can do, top 3 o line, top 3 wr core and a top 5 defense but please go off. When mahones had a similar team was mvp and and 50 TDS lol and now the hurts contract hitting. This off season and next yr the eagles team gonna slowly keep getting taken apart
@ ya I think that question was a little wild you’re talking about switching one of the most QB friendly supporting cast in the eagles with one of the worst in the chargers…. I think Jalen gets too much hate but I think there’s a stronger chance he’s on the bench with the chargers by now over having more success than Herbert has had
Okay John run the poll. I’m willing to bet that less than 15 GMs take Herbert over Jalen. Run it. And don’t “eye test” your way out of this. Ask them since you’re so plugged in. Here’s how you word it, “If you could choose, which QB would you take? Jalen hurts Or Herbert. I bet you they don’t pick a loser. And I’m sure that’s why you haven’t ran the poll yet. I’m calling you out on that because I watch your videos daily, and when you talk about this topic, you give Jalen flowers then you turn around and say “BUT..” then proceed to say they’d pick herber over him. IM CALLING YOU OUT! RUN THE POLL!! I think you know they won’t pick him that’s why you haven’t done it yet.
And I believe if Hurts wasn't on the Eagles in the offense chartered to him with elite weapons. He'd be as bad as Justin Fields. Maybe worst. Fields is a better athlete.
@@HockeyDudeJames2 that’s an idiot take because your SUPPOSED to build the team around the qb and cater to him….what type of loser excuse making mentality are you on? He made his weapons “elite”
@@donavan953there’s always at least one clowm in these comments accusing Middlekauff or Cowherd of racism from behind the safety of a screen. Just stop talking. Shut up.
I don't know about that. Most of the Chargers fans I know were rooting for us to beat the Chiefs in the Super Bowl. I think a lot of them are more upset about Herbert 's underwhelming performances in the playoffs.
I’m a Herbert fan but I’m a Charger fan first, if he’s not giving us the postseason wins needed for a chance for a SB then maybe we need a change but with harbaugh coming in I’ll give more chances for now
A qb can't win on his own. The Chargers still don't have a good oc, but they have a below average run game and a severe lack of talent in the receiving corps. And when Herbert had good receivers, they couldn't stay healthy. To win in the post season you need to have a complete team, unlike the Chargers whose offense is a work in progress. If you look at the roster, they overachieved, as did the Broncos.
Jalen Hurts is CLEARLY the better QB. If Jalen Hurts threw 4 interceptions in the playoffs like Herbert did, he would be crucified. Hurts shows up when it matters most. TBH, Herberts best year was his ROOKIE year. He hasn't improved 1 iota since then..
@ that argument is hilarious considering no one thought the eagles had a chance through probably week 8 this season. Only became a superteam once they beat the shit out of the chiefs. It was trendy to pick against them in every playoff game lol
@@itsyaboipaulychips4498 you and other people in these comments are conflating team achievements with QB abilities/skills/stats when comparing Herbert and Hurts. People keep mentioning records, playoff wins, yada yada. But when Middlekauff says teams will take Herbert over Hurts, he is talking about the talent and skills presented on tape. It's not that hard to understand
So here is my issue with the 31 GMs take. Shady said it best “why are we acting like GMs don’t get it wrong”. The league is full of bad and mediocre organizations. I wouldn’t use them to make my points personally 😂😂😂😂. …Hold up hold I am in my 40(and I’ve never seen it) and no one comes into the Linc and takeover to include the Steelers stop it lol
Funny thing about the torpedo bats, Judge isn’t using it at the moment. Also they were in use last year and quite a few players like Fransico Lindor are using it currently
Totally get why casual viewers rag on Herbert, but it is absurdly lazy to completely remove context from these discussions. The reality is that no matter how good a single player is, they can't endlessly elevate players around them. Herbert has gotten two pretty 'meh' teams to the playoffs twice and they went nowhere. But it's a TEAM game, so no wonder. Does Jalen get the 2024 chargers to the playoffs? 😂 not a chance. But he wins a SB with the best TEAM. Make the best roster top to bottom and even average QBs can be heros.
32 teams are NOT taking Herbert over Jalen. Cut it out, not even harabaugh would take Herbert over Jalen. Jalen is his play-style type of quarterback. Game manager with running ability and CLUTCH.
All you Herbert haters need to ask yourself how any other quarterback would have fared with the disaster that the Chargers have been the last few years even in the playoff game against the Texans his entire interior offensive line collapsed on him every single play you think Jalen would survive that hell no
@@HARLEMWILLIAMS-z5e where's that chargers defense now? gone lol where's staley?? HC anywhere? how about coordinator??? exactly... cuz herbert was dealing with a TRAIN WRECK coaching this team. now he has a real coach and made the postseason in a year he's throwing to gardeners and lawn mowers
You would’ve never thought that Herbert had a Bosa brother, Khalil Mack, Derwin James, and Keenan Allen on his team. Stop making excuses for Justin , the GM surrounded him with talent and he repaid him with 2 playoff losses.
@@Que____G ok let's take a look at the talent you listed. Bosa has only one 10 sack season since Herbert entered the league and has missed a bunch of games. Khalil Mack is the best player among them, but for the last few seasons outside his prime. Derwin is great, but a safety, so not a premium position, and was misused by Staley for a few seasons. And Keenan Allen is a good receiver but not very dynamic. His career stats are low caliber/borderline pro bowl level. He is nothing like a Chase/Jefferson/Hill/AJ Brown. So to summarize: this is the elite talent surrounding Herbert throughout his career? The only great player is Mack, who is past his prime, and maybe Allen, who isnt elite whatsoever. Pretty bad argument my guy
@@Que____G found the fan that doesn’t watch the chargers NEARLY enough to even converse with we actual fans lol the term “talent” is severely misused when it comes to the chargers. Talent isn’t talent when it fails in huge moments and or is injured. We finally have a culture removing all of that. It’s not gonna happen overnight. And they STILL won 11 games with Will Dissly and Tucker Fisk as some of the primary weapons ☠️😂
All things being equal, I’m still taking Justin Herbert over Jalen Hurts. I would also take Fran Tarkenton over Terry Bradshaw, Dan Marino over Troy Aikman, and Matt Ryan over Eli Manning. Those guys never won the big game but they were clearly more skilled quarterbacks. It would be nice to see a little more nuance in discussions like this, but I understand I’m asking too much from a RUclips comment section. Hurts is on a better franchise with a better supporting cast and just won the Super Bowl, which obviously means he’s a better player. No further discussion needed I guess.
If Mahomes was on the Eagles he would be undefeated every year with those receivers and defense and I like Hurts he’s a star but he’s on a very good team they carry him more than he carries them I’d put it that away.
I definitely remember that! Dude got up shortly afterwards too and walked away from it. I believe that year had a lot of blowout losses in the playoffs, which resulted in the 28-3 Super Bowl game that I thankfully stuck around to watch the end of.
Jalen balled out all year fr. And deserves his flowers and maybe a statue beside foles. But Philly folks and Jalen himself know that howie is the star of the team full stop.
Making the point that 31 teams would choose Herbert over Hurts isn't an indictment on Hurts. It speaks to why most teams aren't good at evaluating QB talent and constantly get it wrong because of their own biases. 31 teams passed on Lamar Jackson but took Sam Darnold, Baker Mayfield, and Josh Rosen before him. These guys aren't that bright.
Everyone is saying hurts is better but ignoring the fact that they literally have the #1 running back, receiving duo, offensive line, defensive line, and overall defense. Most stacked team arguably in history but the QB gets all the credit
Another one that says herbert had the worst game of his life under all that pressure. Then mahomes sees same pressure in sb against Philly and has a terrible game but he says mahomes needs help. Stay consistent my guy. Both games had their qb see 50%+ pressure rate, 3+ dropped passes, multiple sacks and qb hits and the list goes on. Goal posts need to stay in place.
Fastest WRs in Each Decade: 1960s: Bob Hayes 1970s: Cliff Branch or Isaac Curtis 1980s: Ron Brown or Willie Gault 1990s: Joey Galloway 2000s: Randy Moss 2010s: DeSean Jackson then Tyreek Hill 2020s: Tyreek Hill
I agree with your take on the Patriots. Loved watching Drake Maye last year and he showed some flashes of what he can do on the field. But he still has a lot of work to do and get better at making good decisions on the field. He has all the tools but has not achieved anything yet so people have to lower their expectations. A season in the 7-10 to 9-8 region would be a success right now. But I have to disagree on the Diggs-Trade. Lets just ignore the 69 millions because at the moment this is only a number. If Diggs really manages to get 69 millions at the end it also means that he performed at an exeptionell high level that it would be worth paying 69 millions. If not, the Patriots have lost 26 millions. With the cap space they have this is no big deal. The current Reciever Room is so bad that every help is welcomed. Even a Diggs on 80%. And his personality is just a minor concern for me. Vrabel and Josh McDaniels have the experience and authority to keep these sorts of players under control. Diggs has a lot of experience, is an exeptional route runner. Even if he has lost his top speed and is not the deep threat he once was he can be our work horse and showing the young recievers how its done. He is super competitive and might bring some fire into that locker room. Sure, there were other players on the market I would rather have but they were almost impossible to get: Higgins => Wanted to stay with Joe Burrow and got paid a lot of money btw Adams => Wanted to Join a "Win-Now"-Team, which is not the Patriots Metcalf => Don't know if its true but it was rummored that he hated the New England region and didn't want to come here even if the Patriots had the better offer Godwin => Wanted to stay in Tampa Bay What other options were available on the market? Kupp ? too Old Cooper ? cooked At least Diggs was on paste for another 1000 yards season before he tore his ACL. I really don't see the risks in this deal. If Diggs disappoints cut him after a year. If not you have a foundation to build on and give Drake Maye a reliable weapon in the offense for atleast 2 years.
Smoothed brained people in the comments talking like the Eagles have had terrible players lmao the way they glaze Hurts you would swear that he has been dragging the Panthers to the playoffs all these years lmao
It's so hard to do a straight-up 1-1 comparison of players because we've seen over the years that the real mitigating/controlling factor in a player's success tends to be the situation they are in. To compare players then you need to place them in opposite situations to truly know which is or would be better and that's simply not possible. My gut tells me that if you put Herbert on the Eagles he's be every bit as successful as Hurts has been and putting Hurts on the Chargers I really don't see a path to them being much better but do we really know for sure? We see it now with a bunch of "failed" QBs like Geno and Baker and now Darnold... get them out of the cesspools of New York/Cleveland and suddenly they look like the players they were drafted to be. The real test can come this season if (when) Tua inevitably gets hurt again and they throw Zach Wilson in and after 1 season watching with Sean Payton and now with McDaniel suddenly he looks like the player he was supposed to be.
The problem with the Packers is with two guys, and one no one wants to admit to, or even think about, because everyone loves him. It's Matt Lafleur. He is the anti-Dan Campbell, Campbell is a great leader of men but doesn't call plays. Well Lefleur is a great play caller but he provides no leadership whatsoever to the roster, when things get tough or start going off the rails he cannot lead the players through it or get them back on track. We've hit our ceiling with Lafleur. And between Campbell and Lafleur, we emphatically have our answer as to which way is better. The other guy is GM Gutekunst. He can't draft star players, at all. His hit rate in the first round is abysmal, and it's not just who he drafts but who he passes on that's horrible. He is too caught up in athletics and measurables and doesn't care anywhere near enough if they can actually play football or not. I knew we wouldn't take Christian Gonzalez, Brian Branch or Cooper De Jean (yes we could've had all 3 of these guys) because they didn't have the physical measurables Gute likes. Instead we took guys that were... head scratchers (at best) like Lukas Van Ness and Jordan Morgan.
No one said those 31 teams were very smart taking a guy that lost a huge lead in a playoff game and had done absolutely nothing over a Superbowl MVP and a big game player. Jalen's a Thinker as Herbert's a stinker. Put that in your mail bag. Can't blame it on coaching Justin anymore 😂😂😂
The Raiders have always been a strong traveling team. Vegas is always going to be a problem and it isn't just divisional. I have been to games against Bengals, Packers, Falcons, and 2-3 others since the move to Vegas. Opposing fans are always going to see Vegas on the chedule and choose it over others. That NEVER happened in Oakland regardless of how good/bad teams were.
I can tell you as a Chiefs fan-- you give me that hurts/herbert poll, im taking Hurts. Not only did he and the eagles beat our ass this year 😅 i see Herbert twice a year, every year. And the dude had tools. 1000%. But he doesnt make the winning plays game in and game out. Period. As evidenced by his career record, and his 0-2 playoff record. Now, maybe if he had an offensive coach, or better weapons, it would look different? But Hurts is in my top 5 over Herbert, period.
I don’t think Judge is using the torpedo bat tbh. He’s really streaky so he’ll probably be like this for a week, then will be off for two weeks. That’s normally how it goes with the Judge.
Have people already forgotten about Tom Brady? He wasn't the most athletic or physically gifted...he just WON. Everyone seems to forget that when talking about Hurts. He's never gonna throw 70-air-yard passes and he'll never throw for 5,000 yards in a season. What he WILL do, is win games💯🦅
Brady could throw for 70 air yards and 5000 yards. He just preferred to let the game come to him instead of chasing big plays. He didn’t get those 7 titles through strong moral fiber, he was the best at everything aside from running. Film study, reading defenses, pocket awareness, throwing deep, throwing short, everything. Not to mention he had great coaches, o-lines, pass catchers and defenses for most of his career, because winning is ultimately a team effort and not a fair evaluation point between individual players in very different situations. I hope you see what I’m getting at here when it comes to Hurts and Herbert.
The Texans game wasn’t all Herbert’s fault. Almost every single catch was dropped by his “NFL level receivers”. The offensive line had their worst game.
For the Herbert haters. His pressure rate vs the Texans was higher than the pressure rate Mahomes had in the Super Bowl. Herbert just forced the ball because fuck it, trying to make something happen
I think 2026 is a make or break season for Herbert to take the next step and at least win a playoff game and if the chargers don't make the playoffs they will probably be ready to trade him while he's still in good shape and he's still a bit of a mystery and he has to become a leader of the team and I'm not sure what his contact is but he is a little bit of a bust to lose the teams 2 playoff games losing a big lead against the Titans and he was a turn over machine in the playoffs last season
Justin by far, I had more weapons in my highschool offense then he does, give him eagles online, aj, smith, bark, goedert, Herbie throws for 6,000 yards with 70 tds
Herbert is a better passer by far. But, Hurts is a better athlete/winner! I'd take Hurts, he's proven! Im over the potential talk of Herbert. It's been 5/yrs now in the league. And Herbert's achieved nothing of substance yet.
Herberts YPA is much lower. The true guage NFL teams use to assess passing effectiveness. It’s a common misconception amongst ESPN fans that hurts can’t destroy you with his arm. But he actually grades out as one of the most accurate throwers, elite deep ball & never turns it over. AJ Brown and smith have both broken separate all time franchise records with him throwing them the ball. He has weaknesses for sure. He doesn’t throw over the middle often & inexplicably doesn’t throw to the easy read sometimes. But math says He’s an elite passer when he throws if not always an elite progression decision maker. But mahomes and Allen are also not great progression qb’s
On the cards, the sayin ur looking for: the first gen are the risk takers, the 2nd gen are the caretakers and the 3rd gen are the undertakers for burying the org. This is why smart 2nd gens ( or 1st gens last wife lol ) sell the team when it’s peaking and/or the old man has died off .
Caleb also had 3 different coordinators, the worst OLINE in the game and coach EverLose…. Middlelopf has never even scored a TD in sandlot football if he doesn’t think those things are extremely important. No leadership- the players wanted Shane Waldron fired at OTAs. They told EverLose as much…. No protection, no scheme, no chemistry 3500, 20-6 TD ratio is miraculous in that situation and Jayden Daniels would have likely been pedestrian as well…. Context matters MuffleCuff
the question is what would happen if they switched teams? It’s all speculation but I think Hurts would be a disaster with the Chargers or most of the teams
Hurts is more accurate, is a better runner, is better situationally. It's not really a debate. Herbert last game, he had a 43% completions and 4 interceptions. Yall gotta stop with the idea of a player and actually watch how they play, every game, every down.
First I miss elite pitcher performances, especially complete games. Overemphasis on hitting and pulling pitchers ruined baseball for me. Second, Jalen over Herbert. I have been a Jalen critic for years now which puts me in an odd position being from the area. I still think he's not a great passer, particularly not for a west coast style offense. However he excels in other aspects which leads to winning football. He's coachable and adaptable. But more importantly I do not believe in Herbert. Never have. He's the type of player that disappears when the pressure hits. He plays one way. He's had plenty of talent around him. It's on him and he has failed.
Makes no sense! Hurts has made it the Super Bowl 2x and just won. He just acknowledged that he shows up when he counts. And even with that you’re saying folks would still rather go with the hypothetical of what Herbert could be. How does that make any sense at all?
Hurts wouldn’t win 3 games with the chargers roster. People who talk shit abt Herbert, don’t watch him play. I’ve never seen a player carry a team like he does
I wonder how good the Bills would be if there were other football teams in their division? They would not make the playoffs if they were in the AFC North, AFC West, NFC North, or NFC East.
I like Jalen won’t take anything from him he’s been in 2 Superbowls winning one ,but he’s on the team with by far the best defense going right now I believe Herbert,Allen ,Lamar maybe even Baker could win with that team .If you don’t think Herbert is a good QB borderline great you don’t know football though,he’s never been on a team anywhere near as good as the Eagles.
At this point..I just laugh when ever I hear the "Give them what Hurts has and he'd win a superbowl" argument. Hurts is literally shattering expectations and going to SUPERBOWLS!!!
You switch QB’s, put Hurts on the Chargers and Herbert on the Eagles. Hurts doesn’t take the Chargers to two SB’s winning one. He just doesn’t. The Eagles have perhaps the best roster in the NFL and Hurts clearly benefits from that.
Herbert is pre rams stafford. People who don’t watch him play every game don’t understand the hype. Both were hindered by cheap owners, bad gms, bad rosters, and bad coaching at the start of their careers. Luckily Herbert now has the coaching owners and gm part fixed, and they’re in the process of fixing the roster. But these next few years are going to prove a lot of people wrong, especially those who view qb play through just wins, losses, and postseason success only. Hurts is undeniably clutch and raises his play in big games, but he also has had a dramatically better support system than Herbert. That being said hurts has had the better career so far no argument, but going into the next 5 years there’s no way you can convince me to take hurts over Herbert if I had to chose one
@ his offense has had weapons (hence why his first 3 years they scored the most points ever in a 3 year stretch) the issue was their defense, that gave up more points then they scored in that same stretch. Which is just crazy because they had defensive head coaches before harbaugh, and immediately their defense was elite. People undervalue how much coaching staffs matter in the nfl
@ thing is people say Herbert had weapons as if he’s ever had an elite reliable weapon. If you do believe his weapons were elite then please explain their stats this past season to the season before with Herbert. Thing about Herbert is he elevates everyone which is why cast offs like Will Dissly have career years playing with him even under a run heavy scheme.
Wow, a well-thought and well-articulated answer that takes many factors into account and arrives at a reasonable conclusion? You’re just a hater bro, Hurts is clearly better
The problem is that everyone goes to Vegas as a trip. Me and my friends went to the commanders Vegas game a few years back and planned our whole Vegas trip around that. The crowd was like 70% commie fans. New relocated teams like Vegas and Rams just can’t build up a consistent fanbase rn
this debate was over 3 years ago 😂
“That Tua contract looks good”
- Cleveland Browns
Justin Herbert is 1st Team All-Hypothetical
And the hypothetical is if he had the best team and coach ever and Mahomes got injured and Andy Reid retired he would at least win his division 😂
This right here!!! You get a cookie
He took a way less roster to the playoffs. Sorry for preferring a QB who has a 5000, 40 td season.
@HockeyDudeJames2 how that work out for you against Houston?
@@jesusabueno1701 I'm not a chargers fan so I don't have a dog in the right. I just believe if Hurts was on the chargers. They aren't in the playoffs.
Wishing everyone a smooth and relaxing Monday! Let's make it a good one.
Seems like Jalen has become the QB yall WANT Herbert to be so bad and Herbert has become the QB yall want Jalen to be. The IRONY!!!! 😂😂😂😂
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 the accuracy in this is insane
@@taronowens5338 a QB that doesn't process the field, throw with timing or anticipation and looks almost incompetent when one of his #1 wrs is out?
So true
@@HockeyDudeJames2no the Super Bowl champion a and mvp dummy
@@3Techers Nick Foles was a SB MVP
Win one super bowl before saying bills are the patriots of old, what a insult
He was referring to them owning the division, calm down
How is this even a question? One guy has 2 pro bowls, 2 sb appearances, sb ring, and a Super Bowl MVP. The other guy has nothing but a one pro bowl. This is disrespectful.
History has taught us time and time again that the eyeball test doesn't tell you everything. There's been a lot of fantastic athletes that have failed to quarterback in the NFL.
Yep .give me the guy holding the trophy smoking a cigar
Jalen is All Pro too lol
One pro bowl due to others not playing
@@ekoboyz757due to the fact he was in the Super Bowl.
Does everyone just pretend that rushing stats don’t count? Jalen played 18 games total this season. (Counting playoffs) He completed 70% of his passes. Threw for 3,629 yards. 8 ypa. 23 TDs and 6 ints. That ALONE makes him competitive with Herbert. Hurts RUSHED for 824 yards!!!!!!!!!!!! There is no way 31 GM’s would choose Herbert over Hurts knowing what they know now. Just admit you’re wrong dude. You’ll still be good at your job.
This!!!!!
Most GM’s would choose Herbert on the basis he’s a throw first pocket QB who is 6’6” and has never had an oline remotely close to Jalen’s
@@CarlitosDMartinezTrevor Lawrence is tall too 🤷🏾♂️
@@dawillia88horrible comp. One has 137 passing touchdowns and 45 picks , which is a 3-1 td to int ratio while the other has 69 and 46 and a 1-1 td to int ratio, Herbert is on a whole nother level compared Lawrence.
@@Smegma59 Hey! I think you may have misunderstood my point. I brought in Hurts’ stats to demonstrate that his passing numbers are actually not as bad as people thinks wish pushes him closer to Herbert, passing wise than Hurts gets credit for. Those are the numbers. My point is, that when you account for Jalen’s rushing then it’s hard to choose Herbert. The guy above pointed out some of Herbert’s measurables as the reason GM’s would choose Herbert. Height being one of them. My point was Trevor Lawrence is tall too; it doesn’t really mean that much in the end. So I wasn’t really comparing Herbert to Lawrence.
Overall, sure every GM would take Herbert over Hurts…5 years ago. But knowing what we know now; why would a team like the Eagles not want a super accurate dual threat running back? I don’t even have an issue with some GM’s taking Herbert. Dude is great. This guy said 32 GM’s would. It’s just disrespectful.
Love the show!! The Caleb Williams take is nuts. His first half stats are just as good if not better. He also had to work with a terrible 15 play script to start games
I'm thankful for RUclips in that I was introduced to John Middlekauff.
Jalen Hurts is 11 - 3 lifetime against Patrick Mahomes, Josh allen, Joe Burrow, Jayden Daniels, Matt Stafford, & Lamar Jackson. Not ONE of those QB’s has a winning record against him. There is Zero argument of Justin Herbert over Jalen Hurts… Hilariously though, Herbert is 1 - 0 against Hurts catching him many years ago when this was still a valid argument.
Herbert is the better qb, the Eagles are the much better team. Glad I could help
@@Tmindful182 so when the chargers and eagles both sucked as a team Herbert was better…. Got it lol
@@Jiveturkey6969Herbert likely was better then! That ship sailed a long time ago however. Herbert was born good. Hurts had to rocky balboa his way to championship MVP with heart grit and determination.
@ he looks the same but now he has the best supporting cast in the NFL……
@@Jiveturkey6969nice try jiveturkey6969
Hurts over Herbert! All of the excuse making for Herbert is sickening.
So true. Hurts just doesn’t fit the medias prototype QB like Lamar and Mahomes even.
Switch the two guys rosters. Give hurts the chargers roster, give Herbert the eagles roster. See who looks better.
@@ryanwhite9437 doesn’t really matter Hurts has been a winner everywhere he’s gone he also has been an all pro something Herbert has never done
Herbert is the new Stafford and that is both to say Herbert is borderline elite and Stafford is a lil overrated
19:28 literally just found you 3 days ago through the algorithm 💪🏾
You’re 1000% CORRECT! Baseball is much much more popular and profitable than the media says it is
Herbert v Hurts is the PERFECT podcast/debate show topic! Hurts has the wins that matter most and played pretty damn well in his two biggest games. One a SB win!! Herbert has ALL the measurables; height, mobility, arm strength, etc. but is a .500 QB with no playoff wins. Everybody would take Hurts career to this point. But if you’re building a team and can choose your QB it’d be hard not to pick Herbert. The age old ‘if you put him on the Eagles’ with that team is pretty true for once…
It’s not true. The eagles would’ve been bounced in the first round. Herbert shrinks in big games. He doesn’t have a killer gene in his body. Changing teams or talent around him won’t ever change that. He’d somehow shit the bed in playoffs n eagles would get bounced.
That’s not true either, he’s never had the offensive AND defensive support around him that Hurts has. Jalen makes the most of it and plays his best in big moments USUALLY. You’re conveniently forgetting when they shit the bed against the Bucs in the 1st round of the playoffs… Hurts knows who he is and doesn’t try to prove he’s something he’s not. Its much easier to be the trust fund kid who just needs to not crash the BMW…
@ he did in 2021 when he lost to the jags in the playoffs after being up three scores
Hurts is perhaps the best leader at QB in the league. Herbert is talented but does not have what Hurts has.
@@ChiefsFan15-q8y lol Jalen didn’t shit the bed against the Bucs in 23………he was 25/35 for 256 yards n 1 TD. That’s not shitting the bed buddy. The team had already quit weeks before. Shitting the bed is what Herbert does throwing 4 picks or blowing a 27 pt lead. Or what Mahomes just did in the SB. That’s shitting the bed💯….shitting the bed means you have to play like shit🤷🏻♂️
John pumps content out his veins
I’d rather have Jalen Hurts simply because he is a winner and Herbert is not. Herbert is the better pocket passer on most days, but he doesn’t have the ice in his veins for clutch time like Jalen. That’s why Jalen has a Super Bowl trophy with two appearances and Herbert has never passed the first round of the playoffs
If the Eagles had a choice between Hurts or Justin, they likely would flip in a heartbeat. Do not under-estimate the talent that the Eagles have on that roster.
@@The_Zilli HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA 😂😂😂 No chance
Last season was the first time Herbert had a good hc, but unfortunately still not a good oc. And he had to work with little run game and a way below average receiving corps, whereas Hurts had Saquon Barkley, a top o line and very good receivers. The Eagles have one of the two or three best rosters in the entire NFL, whereas the Chargers are far from stacked on offense. When Herbert had good receivers - Keenan Allen, Mike Williams - they couldn't stay healthy.
Jalen Hurts is a good qb on a great team, it's not like he dragged a bunch of scrubs to the Super Bowl, like Elway did in the 1980s.
How great was that eagles defense in the NFCC and SB, oh and Jalen Carter essentially ending the Rams game🙃
" Becasue hes a winner " did you forget he has th best defense in the league best offensive line, best RB in the league, A top 5 WR in the league. And he played for Alabama in college....
46:58 No doubt Tyreke is a beast but John you’re forgetting about that 6 years stretch from AB (as crazy as he is)
That’s a NO BRAINER bruh. Of course, it’s Hurts. This is the same dude that has THOROUGHLY OUTPLAYED Patrick Mahomeboy in the SuperBowl….TWICE.
Crazy how like 31 other teams would probably pick the other guy….. ngl I do think Herbert is better also lol
It’s crazy what having a stacked team can do, top 3 o line, top 3 wr core and a top 5 defense but please go off. When mahones had a similar team was mvp and and 50 TDS lol and now the hurts contract hitting. This off season and next yr the eagles team gonna slowly keep getting taken apart
@ ya I think that question was a little wild you’re talking about switching one of the most QB friendly supporting cast in the eagles with one of the worst in the chargers…. I think Jalen gets too much hate but I think there’s a stronger chance he’s on the bench with the chargers by now over having more success than Herbert has had
@@Jiveturkey6969 better doesn’t mean good. He’s done nothing.
@@pooksfaamausili6540 we’re still Super Bowl champs why don’t you tell Justin Herbert to actually make the playoffs?
I'm a Broncos guy and have my favorite team analysts, but John is quickly becoming my favorite league wide source. Excellent analysis.
Love your show, so great
Okay John run the poll. I’m willing to bet that less than 15 GMs take Herbert over Jalen. Run it. And don’t “eye test” your way out of this. Ask them since you’re so plugged in. Here’s how you word it, “If you could choose, which QB would you take? Jalen hurts Or Herbert. I bet you they don’t pick a loser. And I’m sure that’s why you haven’t ran the poll yet. I’m calling you out on that because I watch your videos daily, and when you talk about this topic, you give Jalen flowers then you turn around and say “BUT..” then proceed to say they’d pick herber over him. IM CALLING YOU OUT! RUN THE POLL!! I think you know they won’t pick him that’s why you haven’t done it yet.
And I believe if Hurts wasn't on the Eagles in the offense chartered to him with elite weapons. He'd be as bad as Justin Fields. Maybe worst. Fields is a better athlete.
@@taronowens5338 he always does it with black quarterbacks. And glazes the mid white QB’s. Always a “but” with QB’s.
@@HockeyDudeJames2 that’s an idiot take because your SUPPOSED to build the team around the qb and cater to him….what type of loser excuse making mentality are you on? He made his weapons “elite”
@757CitiesReppa Not every offense is Taylormade for a mid QB. And Hurts is mid. Lawrence is straight trash
@@donavan953there’s always at least one clowm in these comments accusing Middlekauff or Cowherd of racism from behind the safety of a screen. Just stop talking. Shut up.
I thought one of these guys was a Super Bowl MVP??
Herbert is the better qb, the Eagles are the much better team. Glad I could help
Lol
Herbert way better than hurts lool
@@thejaggerrr quess you’re the one that needs help Hurts is a SB MVP, 2xPB, All-Pro, with a 6-3 playoff record, HerBut can’t compete…glad I could help
@@Boltz23 at what?..losing
Justin Herbert fans are so upset that Jalen Hurts won a Super Bowl, it's actually pretty funny.
Which is insane because we play the chargers once every 20 years like bruh lmao
lol chargers fan here supporting hurts and the eagles to beat the evil empire 😂
false..rooted for the eagles to beat the chiefs. FOH!
Yeah this cap as a chargers fan I wanted Jalen to get the dub over Mahomes and before burrow and Allen too no hate here lol
I don't know about that. Most of the Chargers fans I know were rooting for us to beat the Chiefs in the Super Bowl. I think a lot of them are more upset about Herbert 's underwhelming performances in the playoffs.
I’m a Herbert fan but I’m a Charger fan first, if he’s not giving us the postseason wins needed for a chance for a SB then maybe we need a change but with harbaugh coming in I’ll give more chances for now
A qb can't win on his own. The Chargers still don't have a good oc, but they have a below average run game and a severe lack of talent in the receiving corps. And when Herbert had good receivers, they couldn't stay healthy. To win in the post season you need to have a complete team, unlike the Chargers whose offense is a work in progress. If you look at the roster, they overachieved, as did the Broncos.
Ur not a real charger fan lol
Jalen Hurts is CLEARLY the better QB. If Jalen Hurts threw 4 interceptions in the playoffs like Herbert did, he would be crucified. Hurts shows up when it matters most. TBH, Herberts best year was his ROOKIE year. He hasn't improved 1 iota since then..
This take 😂😂😂
EXACTLY
Herbert has had 4 INT games in the playoffs.
Hurts has had 4 TD games. don’t care about the measurements. Jalen has been the better QB by a mile
nevermind one of them plays with the best roster in the league
@ that argument is hilarious considering no one thought the eagles had a chance through probably week 8 this season. Only became a superteam once they beat the shit out of the chiefs. It was trendy to pick against them in every playoff game lol
@@itsyaboipaulychips4498 "by a mile" what? If you wanna say Hurts is better, ok then. But by a mile? What are you smoking?
@ from what they’ve achieved. Not measurements or what ifs. What they’ve both achieved in the NFL Jalen is yes miles ahead of Herbert
@@itsyaboipaulychips4498 you and other people in these comments are conflating team achievements with QB abilities/skills/stats when comparing Herbert and Hurts. People keep mentioning records, playoff wins, yada yada. But when Middlekauff says teams will take Herbert over Hurts, he is talking about the talent and skills presented on tape. It's not that hard to understand
So here is my issue with the 31 GMs take. Shady said it best “why are we acting like GMs don’t get it wrong”. The league is full of bad and mediocre organizations. I wouldn’t use them to make my points personally 😂😂😂😂. …Hold up hold I am in my 40(and I’ve never seen it) and no one comes into the Linc and takeover to include the Steelers stop it lol
Funny thing about the torpedo bats, Judge isn’t using it at the moment. Also they were in use last year and quite a few players like Fransico Lindor are using it currently
Caleb Williams will be better than Jordan Love this coming season, come back here in 9 months for my coronation John 👑
I would take Jalen Hurts over Herbert at the moment. Jalen is special
Totally get why casual viewers rag on Herbert, but it is absurdly lazy to completely remove context from these discussions. The reality is that no matter how good a single player is, they can't endlessly elevate players around them. Herbert has gotten two pretty 'meh' teams to the playoffs twice and they went nowhere. But it's a TEAM game, so no wonder. Does Jalen get the 2024 chargers to the playoffs? 😂 not a chance. But he wins a SB with the best TEAM. Make the best roster top to bottom and even average QBs can be heros.
Yeah Caleb Williams threw 6 touchdowns in the first half of games last season… that’s all you need to know
Cant WAIT for this year to start so Herbert can shut all these haters up!
32 teams are NOT taking Herbert over Jalen. Cut it out, not even harabaugh would take Herbert over Jalen. Jalen is his play-style type of quarterback. Game manager with running ability and CLUTCH.
Uhhhh yes they are. Herbert is a better QB. Nothing against Hurts, he's good. But Herbert is on a different level
@ yet to see the “different level” play lol.
@@donavan953facts 🤣
@@donavan953 then go watch some tape lol. It's out there, it's up to you to actually see it for yourself
@@mattcoccopuffs turn on the tape from the playoff game against Jacksonville.
All you Herbert haters need to ask yourself how any other quarterback would have fared with the disaster that the Chargers have been the last few years even in the playoff game against the Texans his entire interior offensive line collapsed on him every single play you think Jalen would survive that hell no
What’s yo excuse for da Jacksonville game. Stop makin Justin elite when he haven’t done anything. ANYTHING!!
@@HARLEMWILLIAMS-z5e where's that chargers defense now? gone lol where's staley?? HC anywhere? how about coordinator??? exactly... cuz herbert was dealing with a TRAIN WRECK coaching this team. now he has a real coach and made the postseason in a year he's throwing to gardeners and lawn mowers
You would’ve never thought that Herbert had a Bosa brother, Khalil Mack, Derwin James, and Keenan Allen on his team. Stop making excuses for Justin , the GM surrounded him with talent and he repaid him with 2 playoff losses.
@@Que____G ok let's take a look at the talent you listed. Bosa has only one 10 sack season since Herbert entered the league and has missed a bunch of games. Khalil Mack is the best player among them, but for the last few seasons outside his prime. Derwin is great, but a safety, so not a premium position, and was misused by Staley for a few seasons. And Keenan Allen is a good receiver but not very dynamic. His career stats are low caliber/borderline pro bowl level. He is nothing like a Chase/Jefferson/Hill/AJ Brown.
So to summarize: this is the elite talent surrounding Herbert throughout his career? The only great player is Mack, who is past his prime, and maybe Allen, who isnt elite whatsoever. Pretty bad argument my guy
@@Que____G found the fan that doesn’t watch the chargers NEARLY enough to even converse with we actual fans lol the term “talent” is severely misused when it comes to the chargers. Talent isn’t talent when it fails in huge moments and or is injured. We finally have a culture removing all of that. It’s not gonna happen overnight. And they STILL won 11 games with Will Dissly and Tucker Fisk as some of the primary weapons ☠️😂
Starting Monday off right!
Let's go!
All things being equal, I’m still taking Justin Herbert over Jalen Hurts. I would also take Fran Tarkenton over Terry Bradshaw, Dan Marino over Troy Aikman, and Matt Ryan over Eli Manning. Those guys never won the big game but they were clearly more skilled quarterbacks.
It would be nice to see a little more nuance in discussions like this, but I understand I’m asking too much from a RUclips comment section. Hurts is on a better franchise with a better supporting cast and just won the Super Bowl, which obviously means he’s a better player. No further discussion needed I guess.
Aaron judge doesn’t need a torpedo to hit a 💣, unless it’s the playoffs 😂
I thought Scotty S. was going to pull it off for you, John 🔮
Great Sunday for him, but 6 under was just not quite enough ⛳️
If Mahomes was on the Eagles he would be undefeated every year with those receivers and defense and I like Hurts he’s a star but he’s on a very good team they carry him more than he carries them I’d put it that away.
The Cardinals have sucked for more than 100 years.
Get used to it.
2016 was the Matt Moore in the playoffs vs. Pittsburgh
Do you guys remember the Bud Dupree hit on Matt Moore in the 2nd quarter of that game💣💥🤯
I definitely remember that! Dude got up shortly afterwards too and walked away from it. I believe that year had a lot of blowout losses in the playoffs, which resulted in the 28-3 Super Bowl game that I thankfully stuck around to watch the end of.
@IStillJustLikeCats
Nice 👏
You do remember it well 🧠
Jalen balled out all year fr. And deserves his flowers and maybe a statue beside foles. But Philly folks and Jalen himself know that howie is the star of the team full stop.
Las Vegas strip was a mad house in 2023 🥳
Almost 300,000 people there🤯
It was almost like a New Years Eve out on the strip🍾
Who’s better, the guy who threw 4 interceptions or the guy who has a combined 7 TDs in 2 superbowls? 😂
Making the point that 31 teams would choose Herbert over Hurts isn't an indictment on Hurts. It speaks to why most teams aren't good at evaluating QB talent and constantly get it wrong because of their own biases. 31 teams passed on Lamar Jackson but took Sam Darnold, Baker Mayfield, and Josh Rosen before him. These guys aren't that bright.
Everyone is saying hurts is better but ignoring the fact that they literally have the #1 running back, receiving duo, offensive line, defensive line, and overall defense. Most stacked team arguably in history but the QB gets all the credit
Another one that says herbert had the worst game of his life under all that pressure. Then mahomes sees same pressure in sb against Philly and has a terrible game but he says mahomes needs help. Stay consistent my guy.
Both games had their qb see 50%+ pressure rate, 3+ dropped passes, multiple sacks and qb hits and the list goes on. Goal posts need to stay in place.
I have to disagree with the Vrabel Harbaugh comp. Vrabel has to show alot more to earn that comp.
Fastest WRs in Each Decade:
1960s: Bob Hayes
1970s: Cliff Branch or Isaac Curtis
1980s: Ron Brown or Willie Gault
1990s: Joey Galloway
2000s: Randy Moss
2010s: DeSean Jackson then Tyreek Hill
2020s: Tyreek Hill
Jalen gets no credit for the tush push. Yes the Eagles have a great line, but let’s see Herbert run it. So unstoppable they have to ban it.
Eagles dont have a great line. They had the best line in the league the last 3 years 😂
38:47 hmmm.... think about what he said right there...
I agree with your take on the Patriots. Loved watching Drake Maye last year and he showed some flashes of what he can do on the field. But he still has a lot of work to do and get better at making good decisions on the field.
He has all the tools but has not achieved anything yet so people have to lower their expectations. A season in the 7-10 to 9-8 region would be a success right now.
But I have to disagree on the Diggs-Trade. Lets just ignore the 69 millions because at the moment this is only a number. If Diggs really manages to get 69 millions at the end it also means that he performed at an exeptionell high level that it would be worth paying 69 millions.
If not, the Patriots have lost 26 millions. With the cap space they have this is no big deal. The current Reciever Room is so bad that every help is welcomed.
Even a Diggs on 80%. And his personality is just a minor concern for me. Vrabel and Josh McDaniels have the experience and authority to keep these sorts of players under control.
Diggs has a lot of experience, is an exeptional route runner. Even if he has lost his top speed and is not the deep threat he once was he can be our work horse and showing the young recievers how its done.
He is super competitive and might bring some fire into that locker room.
Sure, there were other players on the market I would rather have but they were almost impossible to get:
Higgins => Wanted to stay with Joe Burrow and got paid a lot of money btw
Adams => Wanted to Join a "Win-Now"-Team, which is not the Patriots
Metcalf => Don't know if its true but it was rummored that he hated the New England region and didn't want to come here even if the Patriots had the better offer
Godwin => Wanted to stay in Tampa Bay
What other options were available on the market?
Kupp ? too Old
Cooper ? cooked
At least Diggs was on paste for another 1000 yards season before he tore his ACL.
I really don't see the risks in this deal. If Diggs disappoints cut him after a year. If not you have a foundation to build on and give Drake Maye a reliable weapon in the offense for atleast 2 years.
If Herbert had gone to the Eagles instead of Hurts, Herbert would have two Super Bowl rings, not just one.
The Tua contract didnt work out? Shocker! Who didnt see that coming?
Dudes had 1 season under the contract and isnt even top 10 in guaranteed money
Smoothed brained people in the comments talking like the Eagles have had terrible players lmao the way they glaze Hurts you would swear that he has been dragging the Panthers to the playoffs all these years lmao
This debate Literally Got Cremated 3 years ago
It's so hard to do a straight-up 1-1 comparison of players because we've seen over the years that the real mitigating/controlling factor in a player's success tends to be the situation they are in. To compare players then you need to place them in opposite situations to truly know which is or would be better and that's simply not possible. My gut tells me that if you put Herbert on the Eagles he's be every bit as successful as Hurts has been and putting Hurts on the Chargers I really don't see a path to them being much better but do we really know for sure? We see it now with a bunch of "failed" QBs like Geno and Baker and now Darnold... get them out of the cesspools of New York/Cleveland and suddenly they look like the players they were drafted to be. The real test can come this season if (when) Tua inevitably gets hurt again and they throw Zach Wilson in and after 1 season watching with Sean Payton and now with McDaniel suddenly he looks like the player he was supposed to be.
I found you just from the algorithm
The problem with the Packers is with two guys, and one no one wants to admit to, or even think about, because everyone loves him. It's Matt Lafleur. He is the anti-Dan Campbell, Campbell is a great leader of men but doesn't call plays. Well Lefleur is a great play caller but he provides no leadership whatsoever to the roster, when things get tough or start going off the rails he cannot lead the players through it or get them back on track. We've hit our ceiling with Lafleur. And between Campbell and Lafleur, we emphatically have our answer as to which way is better.
The other guy is GM Gutekunst. He can't draft star players, at all. His hit rate in the first round is abysmal, and it's not just who he drafts but who he passes on that's horrible. He is too caught up in athletics and measurables and doesn't care anywhere near enough if they can actually play football or not. I knew we wouldn't take Christian Gonzalez, Brian Branch or Cooper De Jean (yes we could've had all 3 of these guys) because they didn't have the physical measurables Gute likes. Instead we took guys that were... head scratchers (at best) like Lukas Van Ness and Jordan Morgan.
First time a thumbnail has pissed me off😭
Great draft to experience
No one said those 31 teams were very smart taking a guy that lost a huge lead in a playoff game and had done absolutely nothing over a Superbowl MVP and a big game player. Jalen's a Thinker as Herbert's a stinker. Put that in your mail bag. Can't blame it on coaching Justin anymore 😂😂😂
I was laughing my ass off when Dolphins took Tua 🤣
For anyone needing a job here are some theatre good:
Post office/mail carrier
Spectrum
FedEx
UPS
Calvin Johnson, John?
That first mail is very questionable. I love the Patriots. Always been a fan but Josh Allen comparison on the 2nd year isn't really a good thought
The Raiders have always been a strong traveling team. Vegas is always going to be a problem and it isn't just divisional. I have been to games against Bengals, Packers, Falcons, and 2-3 others since the move to Vegas. Opposing fans are always going to see Vegas on the chedule and choose it over others. That NEVER happened in Oakland regardless of how good/bad teams were.
I can tell you as a Chiefs fan-- you give me that hurts/herbert poll, im taking Hurts. Not only did he and the eagles beat our ass this year 😅 i see Herbert twice a year, every year. And the dude had tools. 1000%. But he doesnt make the winning plays game in and game out. Period. As evidenced by his career record, and his 0-2 playoff record. Now, maybe if he had an offensive coach, or better weapons, it would look different? But Hurts is in my top 5 over Herbert, period.
Herbert most recently threw 4 interceptions in his first playoff game while Hurts led a dominant SB victory over the favored Chiefs.
At least you’re being honest about your recency bias
43% completions, too. He was terrible. Til he does something in the playoffs, there's zero comparison
Herbert's best is coming. Give him close to what Jalen has in talent please coach Harbaugh
I don’t think Judge is using the torpedo bat tbh. He’s really streaky so he’ll probably be like this for a week, then will be off for two weeks. That’s normally how it goes with the Judge.
Hurts is top 4 QB in the league hands down
Have people already forgotten about Tom Brady? He wasn't the most athletic or physically gifted...he just WON. Everyone seems to forget that when talking about Hurts. He's never gonna throw 70-air-yard passes and he'll never throw for 5,000 yards in a season. What he WILL do, is win games💯🦅
Brady could throw for 70 air yards and 5000 yards. He just preferred to let the game come to him instead of chasing big plays. He didn’t get those 7 titles through strong moral fiber, he was the best at everything aside from running. Film study, reading defenses, pocket awareness, throwing deep, throwing short, everything.
Not to mention he had great coaches, o-lines, pass catchers and defenses for most of his career, because winning is ultimately a team effort and not a fair evaluation point between individual players in very different situations. I hope you see what I’m getting at here when it comes to Hurts and Herbert.
The Texans game wasn’t all Herbert’s fault. Almost every single catch was dropped by his “NFL level receivers”. The offensive line had their worst game.
For the Herbert haters. His pressure rate vs the Texans was higher than the pressure rate Mahomes had in the Super Bowl. Herbert just forced the ball because fuck it, trying to make something happen
I think 2026 is a make or break season for Herbert to take the next step and at least win a playoff game and if the chargers don't make the playoffs they will probably be ready to trade him while he's still in good shape and he's still a bit of a mystery and he has to become a leader of the team and I'm not sure what his contact is but he is a little bit of a bust to lose the teams 2 playoff games losing a big lead against the Titans and he was a turn over machine in the playoffs last season
Justin by far, I had more weapons in my highschool offense then he does, give him eagles online, aj, smith, bark, goedert, Herbie throws for 6,000 yards with 70 tds
Mayfield is the man, he just needs a better offensive minded coach
I’ll take Jalen over Justin Herbert any day of the week
Herbert is a better passer by far. But, Hurts is a better athlete/winner! I'd take Hurts, he's proven! Im over the potential talk of Herbert. It's been 5/yrs now in the league. And Herbert's achieved nothing of substance yet.
Herberts YPA is much lower. The true guage NFL teams use to assess passing effectiveness. It’s a common misconception amongst ESPN fans that hurts can’t destroy you with his arm. But he actually grades out as one of the most accurate throwers, elite deep ball & never turns it over. AJ Brown and smith have both broken separate all time franchise records with him throwing them the ball. He has weaknesses for sure. He doesn’t throw over the middle often & inexplicably doesn’t throw to the easy read sometimes. But math says He’s an elite passer when he throws if not always an elite progression decision maker. But mahomes and Allen are also not great progression qb’s
Herbert isn’t even a better passer…he is a whiter passer and that’s about it
On the cards, the sayin ur looking for:
the first gen are the risk takers, the 2nd gen are the caretakers and the 3rd gen are the undertakers for burying the org.
This is why smart 2nd gens ( or 1st gens last wife lol ) sell the team when it’s peaking and/or the old man has died off .
Caleb also had 3 different coordinators, the worst OLINE in the game and coach EverLose…. Middlelopf has never even scored a TD in sandlot football if he doesn’t think those things are extremely important.
No leadership- the players wanted Shane Waldron fired at OTAs. They told EverLose as much….
No protection, no scheme, no chemistry
3500, 20-6 TD ratio is miraculous in that situation and Jayden Daniels would have likely been pedestrian as well….
Context matters MuffleCuff
the question is what would happen if they switched teams? It’s all speculation but I think Hurts would be a disaster with the Chargers or most of the teams
Hurts is more accurate, is a better runner, is better situationally. It's not really a debate. Herbert last game, he had a 43% completions and 4 interceptions. Yall gotta stop with the idea of a player and actually watch how they play, every game, every down.
First I miss elite pitcher performances, especially complete games. Overemphasis on hitting and pulling pitchers ruined baseball for me.
Second, Jalen over Herbert. I have been a Jalen critic for years now which puts me in an odd position being from the area. I still think he's not a great passer, particularly not for a west coast style offense. However he excels in other aspects which leads to winning football. He's coachable and adaptable. But more importantly I do not believe in Herbert. Never have. He's the type of player that disappears when the pressure hits. He plays one way. He's had plenty of talent around him. It's on him and he has failed.
Makes no sense! Hurts has made it the Super Bowl 2x and just won. He just acknowledged that he shows up when he counts. And even with that you’re saying folks would still rather go with the hypothetical of what Herbert could be. How does that make any sense at all?
Judge isn't even using the torpedo bat
Hurts wouldn’t win 3 games with the chargers roster. People who talk shit abt Herbert, don’t watch him play. I’ve never seen a player carry a team like he does
I wonder how good the Bills would be if there were other football teams in their division? They would not make the playoffs if they were in the AFC North, AFC West, NFC North, or NFC East.
Cannot compare butler to hurts. Hurts is a winner!
Theres no argument to have Hurts outside of the top 5. None
I like Jalen won’t take anything from him he’s been in 2 Superbowls winning one ,but he’s on the team with by far the best defense going right now I believe Herbert,Allen ,Lamar maybe even Baker could win with that team .If you don’t think Herbert is a good QB borderline great you don’t know football though,he’s never been on a team anywhere near as good as the Eagles.
Exactly. Whoever is calling Herbert overrated or not that good or a choker is just plain dumb/misinformed. Herbert is objectively really good
At this point..I just laugh when ever I hear the "Give them what Hurts has and he'd win a superbowl" argument. Hurts is literally shattering expectations and going to SUPERBOWLS!!!
You switch QB’s, put Hurts on the Chargers and Herbert on the Eagles. Hurts doesn’t take the Chargers to two SB’s winning one. He just doesn’t. The Eagles have perhaps the best roster in the NFL and Hurts clearly benefits from that.
Herbert is pre rams stafford. People who don’t watch him play every game don’t understand the hype. Both were hindered by cheap owners, bad gms, bad rosters, and bad coaching at the start of their careers. Luckily Herbert now has the coaching owners and gm part fixed, and they’re in the process of fixing the roster. But these next few years are going to prove a lot of people wrong, especially those who view qb play through just wins, losses, and postseason success only. Hurts is undeniably clutch and raises his play in big games, but he also has had a dramatically better support system than Herbert. That being said hurts has had the better career so far no argument, but going into the next 5 years there’s no way you can convince me to take hurts over Herbert if I had to chose one
On paper the chargers had some solid teams. Injuries hurt tho
Facts
@ his offense has had weapons (hence why his first 3 years they scored the most points ever in a 3 year stretch) the issue was their defense, that gave up more points then they scored in that same stretch. Which is just crazy because they had defensive head coaches before harbaugh, and immediately their defense was elite. People undervalue how much coaching staffs matter in the nfl
@ thing is people say Herbert had weapons as if he’s ever had an elite reliable weapon. If you do believe his weapons were elite then please explain their stats this past season to the season before with Herbert. Thing about Herbert is he elevates everyone which is why cast offs like Will Dissly have career years playing with him even under a run heavy scheme.
Wow, a well-thought and well-articulated answer that takes many factors into account and arrives at a reasonable conclusion? You’re just a hater bro, Hurts is clearly better
Raiders need to start winning to gain home field advantage again especially with how expensive the tickets are
The problem is that everyone goes to Vegas as a trip. Me and my friends went to the commanders Vegas game a few years back and planned our whole Vegas trip around that. The crowd was like 70% commie fans. New relocated teams like Vegas and Rams just can’t build up a consistent fanbase rn
Hurts plays within the system, while Herbert is the system. Name one offensive starter on the Chargers that would start on the Eagles? I'll wait
Judge isnt using the torpedo bat tho....